Tuesday, April 23, 2013

Greer's "Sirius" Documentary - no "Bombshell," just Nonstop UFO Claims

I had previously written about the forthcoming 'blockbuster' UFO documentary movie Sirius, produced by CSETI's Dr. Steven Greer,  which promised Free Energy, and a Dead Alien. OK, so I wasted $10 to watch Greer's UFO documentary film Sirius on-line on the night of its Word Premiere in Hollywood. I watched it so you won't have to. First there was the "Red Carpet Coverage" of the Premiere in real-time before the movie, which apparently is no longer available. It was mostly hoopla, with a strong anti-capitalist tone. The first ten minutes or so of the movie were included.

As the film opens, we see Greer going into a college auditorium in Santa Monica, the audience being checked with metal detectors for weapons. "Most people don't know what a Dead Man Trigger is." Very few people need one. But Greer has one - if the Conspiracy rubs him out, lots of sensitive documents get sent out to influential people. Excuse me while I barf - If Greer actually had any documents as hot as all that, he would have given them to the press long ago.
Greer's Dead Alien

Most of what we see after that comes in no particular order. We are given UFO cases and UFO witnesses in a popcorn sort of manner, no sooner does one bounce up than it falls back and another takes its place. There is no time (or need) for exposition, or analysis. Every case, and every claim, is apparently completely solid and needs no further explanation or proof. The "organization" of the film was such that one could have taken almost any segment of it, and switched it with any other, and the change would scarcely be noticed. Some things that we are shown, for the most part quite briefly, include, in no particular order:
  • President Eisenhower's warning about the Military-Industrial Complex
  • Dr. Oppenheimer saying, "we have done this (nukes) before."
  • ancient aliens
  • Federal reserve conspiracies
  • Oil company conspiracies
  • Laurance Rockefeller saying 'disclosure' will change everything
  • MJ-12 Government UFO coverup conspiracy
  • STS-48 UFO video
  • Dr. Lynne Kitei and the Phoenix Lights, which were not military flares
  • "free energy" claimants, including T. Townsend Brown, Tom Valone, Tom Bearden, Stanley Meyer, John Searl, Eugene Mallove, John Havrilla. Anti-gravity and electro-gravitics claims are made.
  • automobiles that can run on water
  • Conspiracies involving the Masons, and the Bohemian Grove 
These supposed "inventors," plus the ET technology, offers us unlimited Free Energy, but a conspiracy by those Greer calls the "Petro-fascists" keeps us using coal, oil, and nuclear power. Part of  the Conspiracy is to keep us distracted by other things. Even Honey Boo-Boo is depicted as part of the Conspiracy to keep us distracted from ET truths.

The film mentions Greer's May, 2001 Disclosure Project press conference at the National Press Club in Washington, DC. Despite its supposedly impressive list of yarn-spinners (many of whom are returning for the forthcoming Citizens Hearing on UFO Disclosure next week), after a few titilating news stories it mostly fell flat with the news media. But an excuse for this was given: just four months later, the attacks of September 11 resulted in wall-to-wall news coverage, leaving reporters with a mere four months to investigate Greer's ET bombshells.

The film does give us some valuable insight into Greer's personality. He mentions having a Near Death experience during an illness when he was seventeen, and describes how he felt a "oneness" not only with the earth, but with the entire universe. Later in the film he said that it is the memory of that NDE that keeps him moving forward in his investigations. I had previously been wondering if Greer is sincere in what he says, or just a huckster who has found a way to make a lot of money off UFO believers. After seeing Sirius I would say that Greer is quite sincere in what he says, and the money aspects comes from effectively taking leadership of an existing group of people who largely think as he does.

I found interesting the part about CSETI's CE5 training session, "human-initiated contact," which involves, among other things, meditation and remote viewing. They go into the desert or some other remote place, and shine a flashlight or laser at any light they see in the sky. If it appears to flicker back, that counts as an instance of interstellar communication. Many of the ET craft are "trans-dimensional," and thus are not visible to the human eye. However, they can be seen using night-vision equipment, which apparently has the capability to make trans-dimensional things visible. I once spoke with a fellow at a UFO meeting who had been through Greer's "training," and he was very impressed by it. He explained that, at first, he could not see any of the ET craft that Greer was talking about. But as the training progressed, he learned how to perceive them.
Stud muffin Dr. Steven Greer at one of his CSETI UFO watches. Definitely the Alpha Male of the group.
One of the longest expositions of a UFO claim is that of the Big Sur missile-zapping UFO in 1964, as told by Bob Jacobs. This case has been totally picked apart by Kingston George in the Skeptical Inquirer. 

"We have acquired an EBE!", boasts one of Greer's CSETI colleagues, and the analysis of this little guy - just six inches long - is the principal "news hook" for the film. We are told that this little body was dug up in the Atacamba Desert in Chile, and ended up in Barcelona, Spain. 3D scans reveal its internal organs, apparently very human-like. Now here is the biggest "bombshell" that the film has: DNA from this creature has been analyzed by Dr. Garry P. Nolan of the Stanford University Medical School. You can read his conclusions here:
Morphologic features include that the specimen has only 10 ribs, mild mid face hypoplasia, and shows abnormalities of the skull.  The observed abnormalities do not  fall into any standard or rare classification of known human pediatric disorders. As represented by a specialist in pediatric human bone and growth disorders (see attached report), the 6 inch specimen is a human that was likely 6-8 years of age at the time of  death (age based on epiphyseal plate X-Ray density standards).  X-Ray imaging and CT scan results confirmed the specimen is biological and is not a non-human primate. The specimen was concluded by the medical specialist to be a human child with an apparently severe form of dwarfism and other anomalies... Reconstruction of the mitochondrial DNA sequence and analysis shows an allele frequency consistent with a B2 haplotype group found on the west coast of South America, supporting the claimed origination of the specimen from the Atacama Desert region of Chile.  Sequence analysis definitively rules out the specimen as an example of  a New World primate.
 So, supposedly the little critter is a human child, at least 6 years old, and only six inches long. This sounds almost as implausible as an ET. I am wondering what precautions have been taken against deliberate DNA contamination? In the case of the Metepec, Mexico humanoid that was promoted by Jaime Maussan, the hoaxer Urso Moreno Ruiz confessed, "It’s just the corpse of a skinned squirrel-monkey. I took its ears out and involved it with all the hair and fluids of all animals I could find, then I dried it. All samples they take of it will come out as being of different animals." Is is possible that something similar has happened with the Atacama humanoid?

In the end, no halfway intelligent person will be swayed by this film. The only people who will be impressed will be those who breathlessly await each new episode of Ancient Aliens on the History Channel.


  1. Mr. Sheaffer, I'm a skeptic who has a movie review blog. I even had a couple of reviews published at Randi.org. Would you be opposed to me sharing this on my website? http://www.DustyOnMovies.com

    1. The author of this thread and all of you who refuse to be educated should listen to the link I am posting from a very creditable source. God this country is full of dim wits.

  2. If Greer and his CSETI colleagues are claiming the little creature is an extraterrestrial, then why are they also presenting evidence (Dr. Nolan's analysis of its DNA) that it is merely a human child afflicted with dwarfism? Did I miss something? Please clarify.

    1. Ross, there is no need to clarify - what you just said is exactly correct. The problem is that you're expecting it to make sense.

      There was sort of the hint that this might be a 'hybrid' human/alien baby. That's probably what they'll be claiming later.

    2. I dont think you guys are reading the document until the end. It basically says that more studies must be done to get into any conclusion.

    3. Those very words end nearly all pre-publications and the sentiment is nearly omnipresent elsewhere too, at least implied. You see, scientists are open minded and as such are wary of waving about super mega definite conclusions even when they have dug up ample support for one. This constrasts sharply to a certain crowd...

      The interesting thing to note is that we now have two teams of scientists saying it's morphologically human, with DNA evidence to boot. They do disagree about the inferred age of this little thing though and I have to say that in my ears 6-8 years sounds ludicrous, but that's just me. More objective research is definitely needed, but then again what are the odds of that ever happening now that's in the possession of fanatics that already have their mind made up.

    4. You are all correct, the DNA sequencing found close links to human ancestory of indeginous something or other, which would confer that it is a human-like animal, but there was no genetic mutation that explained the abnormalities found in the specimin. The DNA sequincing cross-references already existing known DNA with the DNA of the specimin. What it does not tell us is what all of the leftover DNA is made of, the strands that the machine found no cross reference from the existing data base, and by the sounds of the Dr who preformed the expirement, there is a vast majority of DNA that the computer found no applicable cross reference. This is where the specimin gets intresting. No mutation to explain how a "human" under these constraints ate, matoblized, breath, and lived for ~6-8 years in an envoironment that had extremly limited medical support. And then all of the unexplained DNA, which is vastly greater than the ammount of unexplained DNA you would assume to find in a modern day human. At least this specimine deserves vast scientific inquiry into how such a vast genetic mutation such as this could survive for so long, and at most because this is possiably an alien life-form.

    5. I ABSOLUTELY agree with you Matt

    6. Greer is just a bullshitter getting very rich from gullible idiots.

  3. Greer's head looks oddly out of place on his buff body. Maybe the aliens surgically attached his head to someone else's body. Frightful operations are conducted in underground alien bases....

    1. yes there are videos of greer where his neck muscles are not anything human..his face shapeshifts..and his pupils do turn reptilian in a few of his speeches..
      here's about 20 pictures of him morphing http://www.whale.to/c/greer.html
      and a video of him shapeshifting on youtube
      Reptilian Dr. Steven Greer UFO Disclosure Project Blue Beam

  4. If you ever want to watch another film about wackos I might suggest the entertaining Children of the Stars. http://www.dustyonmovies.com/2012/09/children-of-stars-2012_22.html

    Though I find these folks less threatening than Greer.

  5. The UFO crowd is going to have to give more DNA evidence if they are going to keep up with the Bigfoot crowd. I've read an account of one of his very expensive training exercises. It seems to consist of you giving him a lot of money, and then going out in the woods with big flashlights. Then you call them to you. He's so deadly serious he has people make a recording of who they are and who to contact if they are abducted. The level of "adventure time fun" is hardly at an adult level. This sounds like something I can easily see for free on cable TV, if I just watch during one of the endless UFO marathon reruns of shows. Thanks for saving me the $10.

    1. Kitty,

      Actually I've already seen posted on-line what must be an illegal copy of the entire movie. I'm not giving any links, I do not support movie piracy.

    2. Kitty,

      I wonder if you are correct that there might be some pressure to keep up with the Bigfoot investigators. It will be interesting to see if the full DNA sequences and other data get published in a scientifc journal. Dr. Greer seems to have found competent collaborators who would be able to get that job done.

      I also note a mismatch between the tentative conclusions of the scientists and the statements of Dr. Greer and wonder how the collaboration will work in the future. Once the data are complete it will be interesting to see how he incorporates any discordant conclusions/advice into his world view. It all reminds me of the Ancient Aliens program in which mainstream scientists offer facts and reasonable interpretations that are subsequently buried by a mass of conjecture and wishful thinking. I cannot know how Dr. Greer will proceed, but do look forward to seeing how the story unfolds. I hope it works well for his collaborators.

      Tyler Kokjohn

  6. My studies on the STS-48 UFO fairy tale, including briefing charts and transcript of material I delivered at Princeton University during a program also involving Dr. Greer, can be found here: www.jamesoberg.com/ufo.html

    If Greer in his movie simply pretended he was unaware of my point-by-point refutation of the entire UFO myth, I am unable to hold the opinion that he is merely sincerely self-deluded.

    1. My brain-fart, the debate was at Purdue.

      And I'm now informed that although 'Sirius' flashes video from STS-48 and STS-75, the narration makes no claims about them.

  7. Your photo of Greer shows that in future we better be careful what we say about him as he looks quite a force to be reckoned with.

  8. From their website:

    The international spokesperson for the Citizen Hearing on Disclosure is Dr. Edgar Mitchell (Capt. USAF, NASA Apollo 14 Astronaut). Since 1997 Dr. Mitchell has been an outspoken proponent for the truth regarding the extraterrestrial presence to be put before the American people. In that regard he follows in the footsteps of another legendary American astronaut, Col Gordon Cooper, Jr. Other astronauts have made statements over the years supportive of appropriate disclosure of the facts in government control being released.

    JimO again: So i emailed their PR department and Janet Donovan replied she would "include Steve Bassett in this email for him to answer any questions you may have." I rattled the cage again today, but somehow doubt that Bassett will even bother to try to defend the claim.

    My note today said, "As far as my own research has been able to determine, no other astronaut has made such statements, that I can locate. Some have speculated on the likelihood of alien intelligence elsewhere in the Universe -- Story Musgrave is quite convinced of its existence, just as he
    reports neither he nor any other astronaut he knows of has ever encountered such aliens on space missions. Both Mitchell and Cooper have always made it clear they never had such encounters on their space missions and know of no other astronauts in their day -- Mercury, Gemini, and Apollo -- who did either."

    1. Gordon Cooper was sent up to chase UFOs over Europe in 1951, which he did in fact witness and chase. He also saw film developed which showed a saucer land at Edwards AFB. Either he's a liar or he is so incompetent/delusional he had no business being an astronaut. http://youtu.be/dvPR8T1o3Dc?t=30s

    2. Cooper's Germany story is intriguing in that every other person in the area at the time -- his flying buddies [and the declassified unit records], the news media in Munich, the Bavarian UFO groups -- have no verifying reports at all. Cooper himself told NICAP sometime before 1976 that he chased something over Germany but decided it probably had been weather balloons. Later his story 'improved', when he had alienated himself from the aerospace professional community and the UFO conventions were the last people inviting him to be applauded. As for the Edwards story, as the sainted James McDonald of ufology himself concluded based on his direct interviews, Cooper himself had nothing to do with the entire event, and the actual witnesses describe a slow drift-pass [at about prevailing wind speed and direction] with no landing or zoom-off whatsoever. Is McDonald a liar, or is Cooper just another old pilot self-promoting tall-tale-teller? See these other investigative reports at www.jamesoberg.com/ufo.html

      When Cooper claims to have saved the space shuttle program from a lethal design flaw by relaying a telepathic warning from space aliens, do we REALLY have to call him a 'liar'? Can't we just be a little generous with a man who once was a hero?

  9. Of all the manipulators who've attached themselves to Ufology, Greer is the one that seems to have the potential to do the most damage because of his exploitative, calculating greed. ($1,000 to learn "the truth" at a Greer conference.) Anyone really wonder why Greer didn't just give his "evidence" to the press years ago?

    P.T. Barnum continues smiling down (or more likely up) at Greer from wherever he is in the Great Beyond.

  10. Why use the 6 inch "alien" or birth defect you find is definitely from at least a full human mother if you have all these camp outs that bring the aliens right to you that you charge quite highly for meeting them? Why not just film a full 5 encounter you say you have unless it is some sort of hypnosis/huckster event.

    I can say I had my nuclear physicist brother go to one of Greer's top secret meetings to share free energy which my brother had in 2007. He was dead very shortly afterwards and of an aneurysm with some type of brain gel like microwaved type event. It was very strange. They said no autopsy could be done for 6 months his brain was so gelatinous and then lost his brain. He'd had an MRI within the year and NO aneurysm period. I felt extremely bad for recommending he go there not knowing if Greer actually is collecting the free energy ready to run scientists for the Rockefellar who funds him. He talks alot about there being free energy but then it turns into this vague event. If the U.S. won't cooperate why isn't he going to Russia or other countries who do think more of humanity if he is so into it?

    I tried to connect Greer with Tesla's nephew for the Fire the Grid of 2007 but he was furious he could not speak unless he or I gave him his exact U.S. citizen name not Sovereign he went by. Greer stated anyone who feared for his life and not giving his exact home address and name not just willing to meet at a discreet location he was not interested in. Sovereign felt anyone putting up what was known to all the delta force as U.S. UFO's of military earth origin as true other planetary space craft was likely a Rockefellar collector to ensnare the free energy he would obviously already know about. Sovereign backed out when Greer wasn't willing to meet with him without knowing details that could jeopardize his life as would be obvious to anyone with the background Greer claimed.

    I do know the technology to power your own home which involves sticking 3 copper poles in your yard is so cheap and needs no team to figure out so all this hoopla over costs is bizarre. Hiding it from the power companies and stealth fighters is more your issue.No I am not telling either as they erased my computer saying it had national security issues and I was a national security risk all over a side effect of electricity. You don't even have to plug into wall outlets or use your cords at all. It bypasses that right out of the air or some thing.The details of the poles have been put in a crop circle then the content erased and the orbs made it 4 fields further down.Andrew Collins photographed the first field before the farmer was ordered to erase the contents only so he left the outline in protest but did as ordered.

  11. Here are some movie review quotes for advertising "Sirius" in the newspapers:

    "Not as good as 'Plan 9 From Outer Space', but it was OK, I guess."
    Plainville Dealer

    "Rollercoaster of a ride, but in a nauseating way."
    Roswell Daily

    "I watched it so you won't have to."
    Robert Scheaffer - Skeptic blogger

    "Wow! Best documentary, ever!"
    Ken Burns, documentary film maker

    "Laugh-out-loud funny!"
    Science magazine

    "Oh boy, we got work to do."
    Skeptic magazine

    "Sirius-ously, this movie sucks."
    TS4072 - Movie goer

  12. Greer has a hodgepodge of people on his side; many are quite amazing and then there are others that blow things down the mortar tube. Still, his horde of people does do him some justice, whereas, I can't stand Greer trying to be the brains of the operation; and, Billy Meier blows most of these blokes out of the water in scale and effort in every category.

  13. Greer is a misinformer. I think he keeps the public diverted from real cases, by his approach. He proves nothing and his methodology is designed to make the whole UFO picture look a bit nutty.

    So for a debunker Robert, maybe that is just what Greer really expected and wanted.

    If you have on open mind open www.theyfly.com and get up to speed. Half a dozen 'debiunkers' have been truying to debunk Meier for nearly half a century, and failed. Yes we have open et contact.

    Go learn before this site censors my post.

  14. Forget the ET linkage. If it is a fact that this a 6 inch human, that in itself is extraordinary.

    What therefore doesn't make sense to me is the lack of publicity in the serious media IF this is true. For instance, there is no report on the BBC.

    And it seems like a newsworthy story even if it is a hoax......

    I'm puzzled by the lack of reports and at the same time anti conspiracy theories. All in all, very frustrating.

  15. Well its good to see the religious bigots are still pulling there private parts. With that I mean the enquirer and anything Randi is involved in.

  16. You mean you watch 'bigots' pull private parts?

    What oh What are you?

  17. Billy Cox thinks that "Sirius" is "riveting," and suggests that it may result in a big boost for UFOlogy. He apparently doesn't see how ridiculous it is, and any competent reporter will immediately notice that.

    He also wites, "But in a remarkable omission for something so thorough and complete, “Sirius” fails to mention Greer’s tuition fees for mastering the CE-5 “Contact Protocols.” Getting a handle on those guidelines requires week-long seminars; therefore, De Void is obliged to supply the pricing schedule: $2,500 for Beginners, $995 for Experienced Level, and $1,250 for Student Level (i.e., full-time CSETI almost sounds like Scientology!


    1. Greer doing Hubbard, I like it!

      He can start sporting Hubbard's goofy "sea captain" getup; and when he marches on stage, the band will play "In the Navy!"

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  19. Belief in UFOs is also an undeniably attractive "ego trip", a posturing of inside information and secret lore, the possession of which puts its intimates apart from and above the rest of the unimaginative world. Such speculations demand more scientific attention of sociologists. --JO

    "I had previously been wondering if Greer is sincere in what he says, or just a huckster who has found a way to make a lot of money off UFO believers. [It's always the question.] After seeing Sirius I would say that Greer is quite sincere in what he says, and the money aspects comes from effectively taking leadership of an existing group of people who largely think as he does."

    Robert; He'd have to be a really convincing charlatan to fool us "skeptical to the max" people, and I haven't seen the movie or Greer in person, but I advise caution in this determination. I've heard about doctor (by training only) Greer and his goofy and expensive exploits for nearly two decades, as you have I'm sure, and his entire act has always been characterized by shameless self-promotion to the point of sociopathy, much like the seemingly insane televangelist Robert Tilton, who, though busted twice, still earns tens of millions every year selling snake-oil "faith."

    Both of these characters claim to have had transcendental, transformative experiences prior to beginning their careers in the "enlightenment" businesses. All the true Believers I've met claim to have had at least one "sighting" or religious "conversion" experience. It's a sort of merit badge that gets one into the special club, "the possession of which puts its intimates apart from and above the rest of the unimaginative world." And we could probably force many positive comparisons between not only these two but most other Believers and self-promoting snake-oil salesmen.

    I'm not so much disagreeing--since I don't know what Greer really believes--but do think that Greer, like Tilton, had a career choice--knowingly self-styled and sociopathic--and a strategy for making it happen. And if their personal beliefs on these utterly insubstantial subjects weren't secondary to their self promotion and money making from the start then they certainly are now.


  20. Negativity, negativity and more negativity! You people really need to get a life, instead of being armchair critics to things you know very little about. You've been listening to a lot of verbal diarrhea when you should be doing your own investigation for the truth! Sheaffer seems only interested in promoting his own limited perspective of the world and the universe around it!

    1. Terry, try to think of what's said here as a positive. It's a win for logic and rationality, for critical thinking and for the scientific method.

      Rather than ridiculing those who don't agree with you, read what they have to say. Check out the posts here (and elsewhere). Test the evaluations and consequent objections to your beliefs. If you can dispassionately examine all of it and honestly not have any questions about your "truth", then you're stronger for it.

  21. Yeah, because Carl Sagan never made *any* money from peddling his views. Right?

    Give it a rest with the "he's doing it for the money" garbage. The data provided by every "skeptic" referenced in this piece should be discounted for exactly the same reasons if you insist that capitalism is incompatible with the ET subject.

    Despite the ranting here, I see no analysis (or mention) whatsoever of the claims of Disclosure Project witnesses. It's as if testimony that would decide cases in our judicial system ceases to carry any weight once it references a topic the self-styled skeptics here consider taboo.

    1. JD, no one said it's wrong for Greer to make money from his pursuits. It's more a question of understanding if that's his main motivation.

      The Disclosure Project was touched on in earlier blogs. This one is Robert's review of the Sirius film.

    2. "Carl Sagan never made *any* money from peddling his views."
      So John Doe can't tell the difference between Carl Sagan--real planetary astronomer, advocate of rationality and Scientific realism--and Steven Greer, a sociopathic fruitcake spinning his queer version of Shaver's ridiculously insane "UFO" conspiracy fantasy. That reveals quite a lot, John.

      "Give it a rest with the "he's doing it for the money" garbage."
      Well, if the loafer fits.... Do you know of another reason? I can't imagine what could be the point in retreading the same old darkly paranoid cosmic-conspiracy fantasy for boys that's been around for nearly 70 years--except for money! It was space-opera trash then, it's laughably stupid now. But you tell! This should be good.

      "I see no analysis (or mention) whatsoever of the claims of Disclosure Project witnesses."
      Every one of their flying-saucer fairy tales has been debunked by good skeptics a dozen times over. The better the "UFO" story, the more debunkable it is. There is no rational narrative that produces an irrational "UFO," but if you'd like to spin one of their FS fairy tales I'll take a shot. No "UFO" story is ever as extraordinary as Believers pretend it is, and the mundane stimuli for those same bare reports are usually easily deduced when the facts in context are considered.

      "skeptics here consider taboo"
      Not "taboo" simply not real. Understand the difference? There never were any airships, ghost rockets, "flying saucers" or REAL "UFOs" of any kind. It's all been nothing but a very well-understood social delusion.

    3. There is a difference between being paid to speak/offer opinions/teach people and asking people to give you money so you can show them how to lure alien spaceships towards you. If you were sold a lemon of a car, you would complain about the sale. Do you find what Greer does to gullible people perfectly acceptable?

    4. Tim, I think you're assuming that Greer is knowingly duping others. Maybe he actually believes this stuff himself, though.

    5. Ross,

      They're not necessarily mutually exclusive. I think there are three possibilities:
      1. He's an unscrupulous con man and he knows it.
      2. He's a believer but thinks that some dishonesty can be accepted as long as it supports the Cause (i.e. the end justifies the means).
      3. He's a believer and he's so blinded by his faith that he doesn't even consider others viewpoints (e.g. when it comes to certain cases he repeats in absurdum, unphazed by all developments on the matter).

      All three involve some kind of lie, and they have to - he has shown that time after time.

    6. Interesting, JHA. I'm not sure if #3 involves a lie (in the sense of a deliberate untruth).

    7. Either Greer knows he is duping people or he is not a very bright guy. In either case, he is not to be trusted.

    8. Greer would have to be completely insane to believe the utter nonsense that composes his David Icke-Shaver mystery cosmic-conspiracy mashup, and in which case, he could hardly be the successful charlatan showman that he is.

      I vote sociopath: Greer knows what he's doing is unethical, even criminal, he simply lacks the ability or chooses not to care. WOIIFTM

      But TP is right, it doesn't matter what Greer really believes, he's just a snake-oil salesman and no one with good sense is buying.

  22. As disappointed as I was with the buildup to this movie, I think people are really missing the boat here. A- We are being duped. Not by Greer (at least intentionally) , but by the corporations, and the government. I am not a conspiracy guy, but more a realist. The tech suppression is beyond what anyone can even imagine. Would you want to give up 4 BILLION dollars of profit in 3 months? Exxon doesn’t. Furthermore, once you have all that cabbage, it makes it easier and easier to suppress information. I just find it very hard to swallow that all the fusion battery guys have either died suddenly, or gone missing. Too much of a coincidence. B. We are being visited. Maybe not as often as people would like or hope, but to think that we are the only intelligent bi-pedal creatures out there is INSANITY. If you really think we are the only intelligent species out there, why do you think you are so special? Was everything else created just so you could have a pretty view? My grandma is still alive, and when she didn’t have RUNNING WATER or ELECTRICITY at her farm! (along with 40% of the United States). The exponential explosion of technology should show anybody that has a lick of sense that we will have the ability to travel outside our solar system in under 100 years. Now think for a second – What if there is another civilization that had a 500 year jump on us? How about 10,000 years? Now, since the universe is a ga-gillion years old, think for a second of a civilization that is 10 MILLION years our elder. Can you imagine the technology? If you told someone in 1969 that there would be a handheld controller that would have more computing power in it than the entire APOLLO space program, you would have called me a NUT-JOB. If you showed someone an I-phone in the 1700’s, you would have been burned at the stake. People, we are still using the electrical system that was invented over 100 years ago! With all the technological advancements, there is something inherently wrong with this.

    We really need to focus on the good, and what is important here. That is disclosure, and releasing the shut-down patents from the last 100 years. Letting people tinker with the hidden Tesla patents, and all the others in the field of magnetism and electrical current. I just hope this gets people talking about disclosure. That is really what we need. That, and the internet to not get censored. They are in a mad scramble to censor it because of the simple fact that they cannot control and hold back technology much longer. It’s not the power of one or a few. It is the power of many. It's like a snowball effect, or a stupid email or video of an otter that won’t get out of some bloke's car. Once it starts spreading, it is like a wildfire. There is no stopping it. This is what we so desperately need. They are doing everything in their power to stop it. Let's just hope that it comes out before the censorship hits. Because once it does, turn out the lights.

    1. "My grandma is still alive, and when she" ***was a teenager, in the late 1920's / eary 30's she*** "didn’t have RUNNING WATER or ELECTRICITY at her farm!" (***missing text from above reply*** could not edit -sorry :)

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    3. You are implying that time is an infallible deus ex machina. This is flawed reasoning in so many ways. Nothing says that given enough time there'll be a huge transformation of the way we do things in any given field. In certain fields it's very possible, don't get me wrong, but it's not a general rule and therefore nothing you can count on. Boats, wheels, shovels... What if Newton drives ARE the ultimate form of outer space propulsion (i.e. limiting everybody to subluminal velocities)? Just like displacing dirt to make room for something needs to involve physically displacing dirt. Think about it.

      You are also implying that UFO skepticism is all about denying possibilities. That is not the case either, and frankly that misconception is really starting to get old (annoying). The universe may well be teeming with life in all imaginable stages of development, let's even assume that some or even many of these somehow mastered interstellar travel. That doesn't matter, UFOlogy is still _demonstrably_ full of junk. hoaxes and misidentifications (non-identifications) and that's why one ought to be skeptical toward the neverending torrent of fantastic claims that people pour all over us (mostly on the internet these days). In general one should be careful at taking things at face value at all times, especially in junk-laden contexts such as this one. Again, ETI is an outright crappy null hypothesis (if time has shown us anything it's that the plethora of UFO-generating phenomena effectively renders any attempt at a null useless) and it bothers me that people don't see just how flawed that whole approach to things is. And just to make it exceedingly clear, my stance (and indeed most skeptics stance) is that perhaps some of the UFO sightings we've had really were extraterrestrial spacecraft (even though statistics and a whole lot of other things sure makes a good case against that). Does acknowledging that possibility effectively mean that one should stop questioning things? Of course not.

      The aforementioned deus ex machina plot device comes back regarding your take on the development of life as well, I might add. Time is a factor indeed, but the issue here is again that there is no goal.

    4. Evolution is not destined to produce a bipedal sapient organism capable of manipulating its surroundings and, in the long run, constructing spaceships. Terms such as "progress" have no place in evolutionary biology as they would suggest a predetermined ladder of advancement of some kind. And the one example we have to look at demonstrates that fairly well, I would say. It took this particular planet billions of years to produce anything more complicated than a microbe. Microbial life almost killed itself a few times on top of that. Over the 3.6 bn years life has been on this planet, vertebrates only existed for about 500 million years. Long after the first vertebrates, humans showed up as the result of some very specific events over many hundreds of millions of years and we've spent most of our time so far in huts and caves. The cultural and scientific framework that led to our present level of technology could therefore be seen as a series of very fortunate events. Still to this day there are people just like us living in the neolithic, and indeed there are other primates abound that are very far from even taming fire. And nothing says they ever will, either. Think about it.

      Also, for earth-like life (as you're clearly referring to) to evolve you need a "metal-rich" star and system that allows the forming of terrestrial planets with suitable physical properties and lots of scattered chemical goodies for life to build upon, like the 92 or so elements that we have here out of which 25 or more are necessary for a human to live (and who knows how much was necessary for the entire process that lead to us). Our sun and its planets belong to the first generation of stellar systems that could provide that. It needed some older generations of metal-poor stars to go nova and create these heavier elements in the first place (hence the common "we are stardust" reference). That adds up to some very real temporal constraints. Think about it.

      Reasoning exercises such as these are just that, exercises. They cannot be regarded as direct proof or even circumstancial evidence in either direction, therefore my point is that they are not suitable tor underpinning anything really. I'm just providing things with some sorely needed nuance.

      Let's get back to Greer and his Sirius thing, shall we? It is what the blog entry is about, after all.

    5. "my stance (and indeed most skeptics stance) is that perhaps some of the UFO sightings we've had really were extraterrestrial spacecraft...." John H, I presume?

      "Most skeptics?" This statement seems contrary to your otherwise rational post

    6. What can I say. Pick any old saucer report, corroborated or not, that lacks any testable evidence (i.e. an anecdote). Outright discounting the possibility that THAT might be "it" is unfair. Then again it's heaps more probable that it's just yet another junk piece and since it's in the form of an anecdote it's _completely_ useless anyway. To date there has been no proof whatsoever, and quite frankly, not even the slightest indication of ETI being a viable model for anything that's ever been substantiated by more than hearsay. That fact aside though - denying possibilities, no matter how small, is not what I'd do.

      What I wrote above comes into mind as a follow-up to that, though. You can't appeal to ignorance. "Due to lack of data, I can't honestly be 100% sure" does not in any way mean that ETI becomes any more probable than it was before (that is, highly _improbable_).

      That's what I meant. Apparently you're now "debunking" me according to the tin foil dude below, by the way. Interesting... (this gives me brain cancer.)

    7. So the accurate statement is: "most skeptics" know that the very idea "UFO" is fundamentally absurd and that a century of "UFO" reports amounts to absolutely nothing. There aren't any real "UFOs" of any kind and there never were. It's an irrational popular delusion that was never even worthy of serious consideration.

    8. JHA; I simply asked a question. It's an important point: There's a big difference between being barely possible by mere suggestion and being barely plausible. The first is a rhetorical device, the second addresses real-world probability, even if it's "least likely."

      Even when someone sounds like a skeptic but then says he and "most skeptics" think it's barely possible that there might be a signal, however faint, in a century of "UFO" noise, I'm obliged to object. I don't think that and neither do "most skeptics."

      For over twenty years on the Internet, new-age contrarians and antiscientific "model agnostics" have attempted to redefine the word "skeptic" by confusing philosophical skepticism with modern practical scientific skepticism of claims of the extraordinary.

      Not only is the rhetorical foundation of such philosophical skepticism fundamentally flawed, they're completely different subjects; so demanding "model agnosticism" on anything but the most arcane and abstract theoretical issues (subjects for which the term was coined) is wrongheaded and just plain silly. It's a device used by closeted Believers, calling themselves "real skeptics" (while disdaining their fellow Believers and "dogmatic" Scientific realists) to keep long-dead issues, "UFOs" and the ETH particularly, under consideration. It's nonsense, a silly POMO PC popular delusion.

      Neither the world or Popperian falsification demand negative "proof," they demand evidence. And absence of evidence is one of several logical and practical positive "proofs" that invisible "unicorns from outer space" are not haunting the stratosphere or the hollow Earth. So we, all of us, can sleep well knowing the world with certainty.

      JHA, you sound like a reasonable person and I'm not attacking you; I'm addressing the topic. And I'm not sure why you said what you did, but if "most skeptics" were unsure of the absence of ET visitors, and even one report was "perhaps," you said, then we'd all be Believers! But since skeptics know the very idea "UFO" is just a delusion whose origin lies in our time of questioning--not that suddenly starfaring ET exist and are all around us, and we only recently became aware of the idea of their existence (I've heard that one a lot)--is why most skeptics ask: "Where are they?"

      Imagine the world without the "UFO" delusion, it would be exactly the same except for the subjective reality of fantasies in Believers' minds, an ultimate Null hypothesis!


    9. If mere abscence of evidence is "proof" that something doesn't exist, then we would have to conclude that everything not yet discovered (that is, everything for which we don't now have evidence) is nonexistent. How would that affect the scientific enterprise?

      Also, if skeptics were unsure of the abscence of ET visitors, and if they conceded that even one report was "perhaps," that wouldn't make them Believers. Believers traffic in certainty, not in "perhaps."

      "So we, all of us, can sleep well knowing the world with certainty." Some of us sleep well without such certainty.

      "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."--Friedrich Nietzsche (from HUMAN, ALL TOO HUMAN)

    10. P1: Ross might conclude that, I certainly would not. In the World, Ross, in the World that we do know and that's under consideration, which is all we can talk about--not the undiscovered possible world. But if I agreed to conclude as Ross proposes, then not existing in the World is merely the definition of undiscovered. Appealing to ignorance with word games gets nothing.

      Ross; Did you read Adler's article? Playing rhetorical games with the imprecision of language and the ambiguity of knowledge is what Believers do to pretend their dead pet pseudoscientific delusions are still alive. Simply because one has imagined "unicorns from outer space" doesn't mean they do, did or will ever exist. Word play will never make the idea "UFO" less absurd.

      P2: More of the same, Ross. Read it again. Anyone who believes that "perhaps" there's a real something to any of this "UFO" baloney is suffering under a mass media-manufactured delusion. They don't have to be zealots to be Believers in the "UFO" myth and collective delusion. If a person is even remotely undecided on the subject of ET visitors, they're victims of the delusion.

      And it depends on how and what one is certain about that determines whether his certainty is justified. Can you really pretend that certainty about the nonexistence of "unicorns from outer space" and the certain belief that these same "UFOs" are haunting nearspace are equivalent? Rational certainty in the Null and PSH is in no way equivalent to irrationally certain belief in the ETH, Ross. We've heard this bit of nonsense repeatedly from you self-styled "model agnostic" types (even if they've never heard the term). Read it all again, Ross, you're all the same to me.

      All Believers in the "UFO" myth must be zealots by Ross's definition; Belief in Scientific realism, the scientific method of facts in the World and the blade of reason is a wonderfully zealous way of living; so zealous Believers in the "UFO" myth and zealously negative skeptics are equal, and some "UFO" reports could actually be something extraordinary, "perhaps" even ET spacecraft!

      Do you really think that any reasonable person buys that silly straw-man and false comparison? Ross, either one understands why there never were "UFOs" of any kind or he doesn't, having been exposed to the virulent meme, he's a victim, a Believer in a delusion, a totally false belief.

      P3: Some of us demand more of the World to sleep so well. We demand to know how things really are, as best as we can determine and grasp the totality of facts about the World, not just how they seem through a fog of juvenile cosmic conspiramyths and raw know-nothing sophistry.

      P4: Try reading a completely rational, clear thinking Twentieth-century philosopher; that's what the subject is actually about. "The Quest for Certainty" would be a good start. Those brooding existentialists wasted a lot of words on the subject of the unnecessary hypothesis--another old delusion that the World would be better off without. I've never wasted a moment on such stuff.

      “One should always keep an open mind, but not so open that one's brains fall out.” --Bertrand Russell

    11. You misunderstand me; I never claimed that all things for which there exists no evidence must be real; I only applied your logic rigorously to point out said logic's inadequacy in the face of reality.

      You charge me with viewing UFO believers and skeptics as equal, yet you regard them both as "zealots." Nice going.

      Pardon me for not groveling at Adler's feet. I guess I lack the requisite zealotry.

      You mention straw men. Tell me, who has ever claimed to believe in "unicorns from outer space"?

      I'm glad science (or your version of it) is meeting your desperate security needs. Sleep tight, angel.

      Oh, before you drift off to Slumberland, let me note that I am familiar with the term "model agnostic." And I have read philosophers you would consider "rational," including Bertrand Russell. You might enjoy this quote from him: "Most of the greatest evils that man has inflicted upon man have come through people feeling quite certain about something which, in fact, was false." (from UNPOPULAR ESSAYS)

    12. Also, why are you suddenly capitalizing "World"? What is the significance of that? It's still "world" in my neck of the woods.

    13. Ross; That you refuse or are unable to accept Scientific realism, the "absence of evidence" law of probability, and the Null hypothesis for "UFO" reports is not my problem. All have been demonstrated adequately, and you're just hanging onto a contrarian disposition, devoid of substance, with confused and snarky one-liners.


    14. Agreed. I believe it very arrogant of us to think that in a universe so vast that we are the ONLY life forms. Now that begs the question of whether we have been visited by other life forms. On that issue, I pause, but I can not imagine that we are the only spec of dust that evolved life and ultimately intelligent life. I also strongly agree that it is idiocy not to recognize the vested interest and power of those who control our current forms of energy and their influence over our and other nation's governments. The only answer I can see is the need for a collective demand for disclosure and IF the movie makes any good points it is that technology, at least in it's current unregulated form, is the light that will uncover the long held secrets regarding what forms of energy are available. It seems quite odd to me that gravitational and magnetic properties have not been far more researched, explored and proven fruit for new forms of usable energy.

  23. Why wont USA disclose yet coined the term flying saucer & 1st USAF statement to media at Roswell declared possesing one(changed the next day)? These were officers of the 1st bomber sqdrn in world to have atomic weapons- but cant differentiate between a weather balloon? Astronauts,pilots,ex-presidents & police officers etc all suffer mass halucinations of balloons,planet Venus,satellites & SWAMP GAS!!! God help America! Look into Cropcircles, & you will find a response to Carl Sagans aricebo message in front of a radar telescope.HOAX you say- funny how "Circlemakers"pranksters with planks can achieve these huge,geometrically precise pictograms,in the dark & rain & not get SHOT by the farmer! Seen as you all seem to know about DNA,how is it that cereal crops have much larger husks that dont allow the seed to blow away to pollinate? Even wikipedia will tell you it has been genetically modified around 10500bc. The same time domestic animals appeared,man began first civilizations(farming,wheel,plough) all around the Mesopitamia region. Genetically changed animals seemed to appear but different from their wild ancestors. The cheetah is very unusual,almost clone like. Today we can modify plants & animals & even clone. Is it so hard to believe if we can do it now, maybe others could have done it back then? Carwashcharlie made some very good points.Emphasis on the GOOD. Free energy.The only CLONES or is it CLOWNS, are the good debunkers,skeptics & disinformants (brainwashed by mainstream media)who cant seem to ask the bigger questions regarding current events & past history, yet quite willing to disssect opinions & persons who have an inquisitive mind. War on terror,war on drugs? Afghanistan is going to produce its largest crop of opium since 2001.

    1. Your comment totally off topic and total rubbish as well. Maybe you should read up on artificial selection, basic mathematics, what Hynek really meant, the evolutionary history of the genus Acinonyx and so on.

      Brainwashed by mainstream media, indeed. Do yourself a favor and ponder on that phrase for a bit. I don't think you realise just how firmly they've got you in their talons.

  24. More personal dissections JHA? Even zoamchomsky is debunking you. Hynek was a debunker for Bluebook who turned to UFOlogy from what he had witnessed. Carl Sagan was turned to skeptic to keep funding going- you obviously havent looked at the message left in crop circle- irony? But MI5 have debunked that. UK military helicopters over new formations? Sounds a lot like black helicopters over mutilated cattle. Media has brushed that under the carpet too. Artificial & selective breeding are relatively modern(basic maths). I am talking about genetic mutations. The cheetah has more in common with a dog than its sabre-tooth like extinct ancestor-Acinonyx. Domestic cattle are very different from the now extinct aurochs(1600s). Gene pool of about a herd numbering 80. Wheat has hextiploid chromosone structure very different from wild grasses(einkorn & emmer). They still havent found other wild grass if it was domesticated through selection, & also modern wheat cant be grown in wild(cant pollinate). We (homo-sapiens,sapiens) all come from a lineage in east africa about 200 000yrs ago. But anthropologists still cant find the missing link- genetics has found our spliced chromosones that differ us from the chimps though! Another genetic mutation!Seems likely someone has been interfering in the natural selection process. or is it "a series of fortunate events"! Basic maths-probability? Mmmmmmm...I wonder?

    1. Greetings Deano.
      There are some interesting remarks here. In Jerome Clark's Strange and Unexplained Phenomena, he writes that the cattle mutilation issue was due to a disease and crop circles started as a bit of fun before taking on a life of their own. He's a pretty hard-core paranormalist, so it might be worth looking into.

      I'm curious about the mutations listed here. Is there a rationale for tampering with cattle, cheetahs, and wheat, etc.?

      What you seem to be saying is that humans are the result of some interference in the natural order of things. It seems odd to think that in 200,000 terrestrial years, we wouldn't have had continuous tampering. If someone took that much interest in humans, why haven't they dropped in to talk to people like astronomers and other scientists and shared knowledge?

      Something that always comes up in ETI discussions concerns human achievement. Pyramids, stone monoliths and the like are all due to aliens. Apparently even humans are as well. What's rarely explored is the why. Why did aliens traverse the galaxy to build things with stone? Is that the most efficient material for a vastly advanced race? To what end were they built? What do crop circles accomplish? Does the fact that cheetahs have more in common with dogs than their ancestors make a difference?

    2. Relatively modern? People have modified crops and animals for thousands of years using artificial selection. Long before the advent of modern genetics that very process led to several domesticated plants carrying on mutations that disallowed them from reproducing naturally, because people were for example selecting seedless mutations when they were found and so on. One example is the modern yellow banana that is characterised by a sweet and seedless mutation appearing as late as in the 1830's and that became the focus of some very intensive breeding efforts (no wonder). It cannot reproduce on its own and it bears almost no similarity to the green/red, non-bent, bitter-tasting and seed-filled bananas of the wild. Look what we did to the buderigar when it became a popular pet in the 1800's too. Wild budgerigars are green, yellow and black and weigh approximately 1.2 oz as adults. Pet budgerigars today come in all imaginable combinations of purple, blue, turquoise, white, yellow, green, grey, black etc (including blotchy, multi-colored varieties), they have increased about 65-70% in size compared to their wild ancestors and they have fluffier feathers and outright crests on their heads and so on (that are absent in wild ones). Some English-type buderigars are actually over twice the size of the wild ones. This all happened rather quickly (captive breeding began in the 1850's) and and it's just the result of basic selective breeding, no in situ genetic tampering going on. In fact, budgie geneology provides an almost unmatched insight into good ol' Mendels framework of inheritance mechanics.

      I don't know if you understand how it works, big mutations do appear randomly from time to time and they can quickly be amplified if somebody is there to make the choice. Sometimes it brings along many unforeseen consequences (such as selecting for behavior only can result in huge morphological differences that piggyback on the genetic changes that you force onto successive generations).. A very recent example of just is the infamous fox experiment in the former Soviet Union, where they got foxes with different colors, sizes, tails and temperaments in no time. By simply selecting the peskiest and tamest respectively from many successive litters they quickly created large aggressive black "killer foxes" and small docile white "pet foxes" with cute curly tails, without anything else than basic selective breeding. Now do it over thousands of years and you can easily turn a large wild-type canid into a small annoying chihuahua.

      Modern cats (that include cheetahs) did not descend from sabre toothed cats, by the way. They do form parallell branches from a common ancestor though. Cheetahs do not have more in common with dogs than with their fellow felines either, that's just a common misconception that stems from the fact that their paws are highly adapted for running and thus show doglike traits (an example of convergent evolution). But their paw layout is the same as in other cats and their general morphology is as well.

      And crop circles, good lord...

      Again, this is totally off topic here. I don't understand you people that travel between blogs and post huge chunks of conspiracy stuff in the comments field of seemingly arbitrarily chosen blog entries.

  25. Gday jozzcooper.Again JHA is missing the point.(selective breeding from 1800s >) Around the end of the last ice age 10500yrs ago,man suddenly changed from nomadic hunter gatherer & became civilized with towns,agriculture,livestock,the plough,wheel & WRITING!! Archaeologists all agree it started with & around SUMERIA. The clay tablets found show the gift of the plough to man,wheat husks & depictions of the 9 planets in our solar system. They & many other ancient cultures all talk of sky-gods. Genisis 1;26"We created man in our own image & likeness". Who's we? Farming becomes sustainable when the crops give a high yield & livestock can be handled easily.My point with the cheetah is Kings enjoy hunting(Falconry & Foxhunting).There are many pictures of Kings with cheetahs for pets(Assyrian,Egyption & Indian moguls).Yes,many modern people have chimps & tigers for pets-but eventually they will attack-cheetahs dont. At this time megalithic monuments started appearing-built from stone so they can last.Even I know it would be impossible to fit a titanium alloy smelting plant,ore moving machines etc into a spaceship so stone becomes the medium-but mainstream archaeology cant explain how granite blocks of enormous tonnage can be transported,lifted & cut with precision without diamond blades & core hole drills.The WHY questions ARE the debate. Spanish conquest of the americas was for christian enlightenment? Gold & Silver & mines full of slaves!! Could it be the aliens came to mine gold in africa 200000yrs ago & created a slave race from the early hominids that were already there? Evidence is coming to light in arch digs there now. As this "modern Man" spread out of africa they reached Australia (60000yrs) & America (15000yrs).Being isolated aboriginals were still hunter/gatherers. Wild buffallo-to dangerous to control, & no cereal crops.Life is just about surviving. Why they come & go is anyones guess,but most gold boom towns eventually become ghost towns. Getting back to cropcircles,they are trying to communicate.How anyone can debunk this phenomenon is beyond me.Some of these would take a team of surveyors a week to set out-let alone appear overnight in a few hrs of darkness. Sacred geometry,quantam physics,fractals,depictions of mayan calenders,ancient egyption temples,newspaper type images,binary codes & the list goes on & on- & appearing worldwide. Mainstream media says its all a hoax-gets forgotten. If you still cant accept these as being made by advanced beings,the artwork involved is incredible, & only a couple of groups of people wont to take the credit? Thats what I call rubbish. Advanced beings are saying hello in a living organism as a canvass-WHEAT. "Let there be bread to feed the many" WHY? Why did bldg no7 collapse on 9/11 when no plane hit it at all? P.S. The Bahgdad museum was ransacked in Iraq war(thousands of clay tablets went missing).Why? Keep asking questions & the truth will always find a way!

  26. Just found the place in southeast africa that goes against all mainstream ideas on history & origins yet confirms sudden appearance of modern man 200000yrs ago ,out of africa migrations, & recorded on sumerian clay tablets. The area is vast,roads,villages,terrace farming & still standing today in STONE.The size can be seen on google earth-rock solid evidence.All in the biggest gold production area of the world.At a time when man is thought to have been stone age hunters.There is also a STONEHENGE type rock calender on top of cliff ,still standing. The website is "viewzone"-200000yr old civilization found in Africa. Have a look debunkers & skeptics. Africans build basic huts-not stone structures.Why would hunter/gatheres need GOLD? Another spanner in the works for mainstream historans,archaeologists,anthropoligists so the mainstream media -again-sweep it under the carpet.Why? Advanced beings giving us free energy is not on the power/profit agenda.

    1. Two observations:

      First off, the comment guidelines specifically say, "Keep your comments relevant, and keep them civil!" I see no relevance whatsoever in at least 90% of the self-absorbed screed you posted here. Rants belong somewhere else, but if you continue, don't expect others to bother with the "civil" bit themselves. Hopefully, Robert won't then decide to apply his rules arbitrarily.

      Second, there's absolutely no way I can take you seriously with these blocks of random, unconnected, and above all poorly edited assertions. Make as many bold statements as you like; if you look incoherent, you're not going to reach anyone. I say this in full recognition that it's probably a waste of time, but have at least given you the benefit of the doubt.

      For all other UFO proponents following along: This is exactly why you're not taken seriously. All such discussions are riddled with this kind of frothing, and I've seen maybe 1% of proponents doing anything to "clean house." Why is it always the skeptics that have to bail out the bilgewater? And should we take it to mean you aren't even selective enough to separate rants from research?

    2. Deano he ‘wrote’, and I have lightly edited: “Getting back to cropcircles,they are trying to communicate. How anyone can debunk this phenomenon is beyond me. Some of these would take a team of surveyors a week to set out—let alone appear overnight in a few hrs of darkness.”

      It depends on how many you have in your circle-making team... and have a gander at the blueprints on www.circlemakers.org... and “debunking”, which isn’t really the right word for it, isn’t so hard.

      And: “the artwork involved is incredible, & only a couple of groups of people wont [sic] to take the credit? That’s what I call rubbish. Advanced beings are saying hello in a living organism as a canvass [sic]—WHEAT.”

      Er, no. It’s an unwritten rule among the old guard of circle-makers that while one may admit freely to making circles, you don’t take the credit for particular formations.

      ‘Let there be bread to feed the many’ WHY?”

      Why indeed. Or rather: wouldn’t that be good thing?

      Keep your cudgels holstered. This isn’t entirely OT. There is a connection between Greer and crop circles, surprisingly enough (or maybe not). To increase the list of his many accomplishments, Greer and his gang actually credited themselves with creating one once — telepathically. You can read all about it here:


      Aficionados will be suitably amused when they learn that on said occasion the gang included Colin “Wikipedia-has-written-me-out-of-crop-circle-history” Andrews, hokey abduction claimant and “medium” Maria Ward, “experienced distorter of the truth” Linda M Howe, and pompous old Etonian George Wingfield. I don’t, but I’d love to, know what the time lapse was between this claim and discovery of the Roundway formation. I do know that John Martineau and his UBI group were rumoured to be very cosy with Andrews, and UBI probably made the formation...

      Andrews has an unintentionally funny account of Greer’s visit to Wiltshire in 2011, complete with huge structed craft (O, aye), here:


      And if Deano really wants to have the answers to his questions about crop circles, he should go read the take on them here (tho’ those who still think the world is full of rational people should approach the comments with care):


      as well as the Wikipedia article on the circles that so offends comedian Andrews.

      Peter B

  27. Pop Quiz!
    Based on the "The World According to deano" Lecture Series:

    1. Crop Circles was created by ?
    a) Mischievous hoaxers and artists
    b) Carl Sagan
    c) Extraterrestrials

    2. Stonehedge was built by ?
    a) Neolithic man
    b) Donald Trump
    c) Extraterrestrials

    3. The Egyptian Pyramids was built by ?
    a) The Egyptians
    b) Yul Brynner
    c) Extraterrestrials

    4. Skeptics and Debunkers are brainwashed by ?
    a) Fox News
    b) Robert Sheaffer
    c) Extraterrestrials

    5. Domesticated animals was created by ?
    a) Artifical selection
    b) Car Wash Charlie
    c) Extraterrestrials

    6. "Free Energy" is available from ?
    a) Pacific Gas & Electric
    b) Dr. Steven Greer
    c) Extraterrestrials

    If you answered "c) Extraterrestrials" for all questions, you passed. Well done!


    1. Actually, according to deano, skeptics and debunkers are brainwashed by the "mainstream media," not by extraterrestrials.

  28. Thank you Ross.This is why I go into a lot of subjects because they are related. Nearly all skeptics find ONE person with phd or "expert" qualifications & because they debunk suddenly the matter is "its been proven","scientific evidence" & "Hoax" come to the fore. Sirius has lots to do with DNA. There have been many cropcirles with connections to DNA.(Double Helix,Wiltshire,17 June 1996,in Barley 600ft long) another in front of STONEHENGE(915ft long,151 circles) appearing in daylight between 4-6pm on July 7,1996. "its an unwritten rule you dont take credit"-very convenient to avoid awkward questions surrounding the making of this formation,in front of security & visitors at Stonehenge. If you looked into circlemakers, a show was broadcast in USA,hosted by Jud Nelson(great actor?) "proving" how they made them. The show was filmed in New Zealand,used massive floodlights,took over 6hrs to make, & was mowed out the following morning.What that show didnt explain,it was marked out during the day,& no footage of the mess they created to be examined in daylight.It was done outside of UK where cerealolgists could examine their handiwork,& floodlight towers would have attracted public & media attention. This was a very expensive operation,paid for by UK govt- MI5. Other sponsors (Mitsubhisi) regularily use them in commercials. UK govt official response "are the result of eletrcal plasma vortexes/discharge phenomenon". This explains the "orbs" of white light,that are captured by videos, & military helicopters chasing them. So first it was "Doug & Dave >91" now "Team Satan/Circlemakers from 95onwards". Still a gap of 4yrs!! Sounds like the crash test dummies explaining Roswell(started use in 50s but were there in 47). Cerealogists are very skeptical,& examine formations with care & diiligence. Man made ones arent precise,the stems are broken, & dont display intricate overlay patterns from multiple directions or increased electro magnetic features. Why do skeptics not allow the other side of the story to be told? I remember a hollywood film starring Mel Gibson,linking eerie aliens to crop circles. The fact remains that these formations are appearing. Man made explanations does not cover them all. Pheonix lights appeared-USAF said flares- not all witnesses swallowed this. Many non-believers became believrs that night. Skeptics instantly believe USAF. People want to believe what their govt tells them. But with the internet you can find many other explanations or unexplainable subjects. I for one am sick of hearing "SWAMP GAS". SWAMP - Skeptics With A Mainstream Program

    1. The Mel Gibson movie featuring crop circles was the hugely popular SIGNS.

    2. Deano persists in insisting: “There have been many cropcirles [sic] with connections to DNA. (Double Helix,Wiltshire,17 June 1996, in Barley 600ft long) another in front of STONEHENGE (915ft long,151 circles) appearing in daylight between 4-6pm on July 7,1996.”

      Insofar as Stephen Greer has occasionally stuck his Pinocchio-style nose into the circle-making ‘phenomenon’ and insofar as crop circles represent a resurgence of ancient-alien lore, and that gets a mention in “Sirius”, I’ll answer this. As follows.

      I suspect (from internal evidence) but do not know for sure that these two formations by the same group. I don’t see or know of any other connexion between DNA and the Julia ‘fractal’ (Stonehenge 7 July ’96). I know three, possibly four, of the 13 people who made the Julia Set. It’s difficult to reproduce precisely only because some of the smaller circles were not blueprinted but done freehand. The story that it was produced in anything from 4 seconds to 45 minutes in daylight and (say some) in front of witnesses, is hokum. Patrick Gross has a tidy deconstruction here:


      (But beware, large chunks are in French.) Gross has a nearly-correct take on why circle-makers are devious with ‘confessions’, a.k.a. ‘taking credit’, too. The Smithsonian article I cited previously is a bit more comprehensive about that. Did you read it?

      More: “If you looked into circlemakers, a show was broadcast in USA,hosted by Jud Nelson(great actor?) "proving" how they made them. [...snip...] This was a very expensive operation,paid for by UK govt—MI5.”

      Any evidence at all—at ALL?—for the last assertion? As for the TV show—ever done any filming, Deano? And why rush when you don’t have to?

      “Cerealogists are very skeptical, & examine formations with care & diiligence [sic]. Man made ones aren’t precise, the stems are broken, & dont display intricate overlay patterns from multiple directions or increased electro magnetic features. Why do skeptics not allow the other side of the story to be told?”

      Okay—show/name me a skeptical cerealogist, please. (Joe Nickell doesn’t count.)
      The characteristics you mention are true of some formations and not of others, and much depends on the type and condition of the crop and to some extent of the skill/experience of the makers. The “intricate overlays” are an artefact of the process. There are “increased electro-magnetic features” only in the eyes of beholders. Jeez, you’ll be bringing up those tired old iron filings next.
      If you were familiar with the skeptical literature, you’d know that skeptics tell the “other side of story” over and over, partly because true believers like to whinge that skeptics don’t address allegedly crucial bits of information, and partly because anyone wanting to demolish any case must, to make his own argument, rehearse the other side’s—as does a lawyer in court, for instance. Also I note no one’s censoring your own idiosyncratic posts here, tho’ the temptation must be strong.

      My last word on this.

      Peter B Swampy

  29. Why is it so hard to accept the possibility that this human lived, stunted, in the womb for six years, before expulsion from the womb?

    1. There has been a lot of on-line commentary about this "humanoid," and somebody made the suggestion that this might be a parasitic twin. I think this is the best explanation so far. It could have been alive (sort of alive) attached to another body for a number of years, and its DNA would be fully human. In death, the two bodies were separarated. I imagine that a thing like this would be considered some sort of Omen from the Gods, and thus mummified and buried with great respect.

  30. I understand this site is founded on debunking any alien-type stories and that’s why Sirius is being maligned. BUT I suggest one must have an incredibly egocentric perspective to believe we are alone in this universe, and be rather naive to think energy companies would not want to suppress anything that impacts their profits and that the military industrial complex is not a self-perpetuating entity that requires endless conflict to survive.

    1. eyeswideshut trotted out the same old imaginary enemies manure by saying:
      "BUT I suggest one must have an incredibly egocentric perspective to believe we are alone in this universe,"

      You are welcome to point to any post or comment, anywhere, where any skeptic made this claim. It is self-evidently not anywhere to be found in this thread, and quite likely not even on this site. Even if you manage to find one someplace, you've accounted for just one person's opinion.

      So would you like to sit at the adult table now, and perhaps deal with the myriad subjects active in this post, or does it make you feel better to cry about monsters under the bed? Because, seriously, this is beyond tiresome, and I'm more than willing to point out idiocy when I see it.

      "...and be rather naive to think energy companies would not want to suppress anything that impacts their profits and that the military industrial complex is not a self-perpetuating entity that requires endless conflict to survive."

      You're not talking any kind of evidence here at all. Profit-motives and military self-justification do not, in any way, support any claims of free energy, any more than they support claims that my aunt lives in Peru. You're trying to find ways in which no one has to pony up anything at all, by blaming various entities with "suppression" - convenient I'm sure. Too bad it doesn't rule out complete balderdash in any way.

      Know how Greer could get around it? Go to another country, one without the resources to suppress him. Oh, but wait, he doesn't have to worry about that - by his own admission, he has his "dead-man" switch that prevents the government from stopping him. So, what's your argument again?

      You know, if I had free energy, I wouldn't have any difficulty with energy companies or military attacks or anything, because I'd be the most powerful person in the world. I guess some of us have the brains to use infinite resources.

  31. Well... I would say the EBE wasn't human. One can't be "mostly" human, and we don't have hybrids except in stories and psuedoscience paranormal adventure tales.

    It's sorta proof that it's alien in nature. You see, it does have what is thought to be DNA found in humans, but the computer isn't designed to sequence most of what it found. That's why they say it needs more study, as it would be like trying analyze the source code of Windows 8 with the very first personal computer. Does not computer, I'm afraid.

    So say they do have a specimen from a known alien body, and they run those exact tests again. What are their options for results? They have nothing to compare it to, so it spits out the parts it recognizes as human or animal on Earth, and it doesn't find any other primate other than some human. The only conclusion possible is that the DNA is "unknown" with some recognizable DNA alleles and cell structures found in some of humanity.

    Personally, I think we're going to find we're related to a lot more than we realize. I hope our history is finally revealed to us soon, but I say be prepared to find out what a mutt humanity really is. The EBE is nothing found on Earth, which is the only conclusion they could come to if, in fact, they found alien DNA.

    Thhe "known alien" I said to imagine: the conclusion would be that it was DNA of "unknown origin." That's all it would say.
    The being wasn't half-human. I feel compelled to be optimistic that it is, in fact a Real Alien.

  32. Why would an alien have a DNA in the first place? This isn't Star Trek.

  33. DNA are the building blocks of life. Constantly hearing about univeral laws would apply to them too so DNA applies as well. Its "human",but looks alien,10 ribs,6" long with elongated head.This is my point-man fundamentally changed from early hominids-200000yrs ago- a blink of the eye in the universe.They genetically altered homo-something with some of their something to create modern man(less hair,strength,greater mental capacity & ability to TALK). Differences in races is the natural selction process from varoius climates in the "move out of Africa". They were our creators & "tweaked" a few other things along the way to give us crops & livestock, & examine our progress. Carl Sagan's arecibo message response (crop circle in front of Chilbolton radar telescope,2001) showed nearly the same DNA structure but slightly different & the pixel image of them was larger headed but on a 3ft 4" body instead of a 5ft 9" body. Is it possible that a smaller body would produce a smaller baby, & have only 10 ribs & be prone to dwarfism defects as well? All this information can be found on wiki & SETI files. The crop cirle or pictograph also had the image of a "FACE" appear a week later next to it. Oh no - hang on a minute- "Team Satan/Circlemakers" might have stomped a bit too much wheat with their planks & we might have the same DNA.Did an excellent job on the face though! Thats not a character asasanation, but I would love to see the "blueprints" on how they set out these! Got a bit clever bringing SETI into it - I thought Carl Sagan was a Skeptic?

  34. Tin-foil man again,glad to say they changed DNA so I dont look like neanderthal or howl like all the chimps-hoax,hoax,hoax. If the man-made circles are discrediting an alien source,answering the arecibo message(adding silicon,correcting DNA,radar source), has possibly drawn more public attention in questioning the whole debate than anything before. 1:Should have taken 25000yrs to be heard 2:Surely they would answer by radar telecope 3:Why humanoid in shape 4:Their solar system same as ours but live on 3 planets/moons 5:Small body & large head 6:Show more complex DNA chains 7:Know of silicon & where to place in element table 8:Display much larger telecope device 9:This appeared in field year before 10: Show our face in crop the next weekend OUR first message into space hasnt been answered , this is man-made hoax in wheatfields. Has any one come forward to claim the biggest prank in history? Wasnt covered by mainstream news. The effort these boys must have made to realize the net effect has made countless more people look into the connection,yet they cant claim or prove they made them. Didnt record their efforts?Security at the telescope didnt witness? The changes or mistakes they made has started a completely new conspiracy & generated more questions? The following year,Alien face & binary message-"Beware the bearers of FALSE gifts & their BROKEN PROMISES". Keep saying they are not alien made but why draw attention to the alien connection.Seems like more SWAMP GAS. I wonder what the motivation to stomp stems in the rain & dark is? Partying sounds like more fun! Shot by farmer? Arrested for malicious damage? Driving hours,no sleep & no PAY??? How do they afford to pay rent? Someone must be paying the bills & keep authorities off their backs. Adverts couldnt pay for all of it. What govt agency?MoD? MI5? CIA?---SWAMP GAS TIMES?

  35. Dear Mr Sheaffer,
    I take exception to your characterization of Dr Greer as "quite sincere" and not a huckster. I attended a week long UFO watching workshop with Dr Greer a few years ago. I heard him ask one of his students about a satellite and what time it would pass by. Later that evening he made a bold prediction about being visited and sure enough when a bright light appeared he claimed it was an ET contact. Kinda hucksterish in my book.

  36. ahh a $10 spot. Not sure I need to know more than I have read in this stack. I will wait for the pirate version.

  37. Greer has a mess of individuals on his side; a considerable number are very stunning and after that there are others that blow things down the mortar tube raise money for film .

  38. There was a scene in the film when they mentioned a Dr John and showed a picture of Dr John talking to the Dalai Lama. That man is Maxime Verhagen a ex dutch minister, for 100% shure.

  39. Http://Documentaryshare.co.uk

  40. 12 facts are wrong in this article, this idiot has done no research on the very subject and content he is debunking, a typical debunker not a skeptic at all,


  41. If Greer actually had any documents as hot as all that, he would have given them to the press long ago.'

    He already did that and the press has done nothing with anything he had given. The 2001 disclosure event which had a lot of awesome stuff in it was ignored

  42. kornerjeff
    i don't agree with making money from this subject like greer is doing.
    this information should be free to the world because it is mostly true
    and very real.if you haven't seen it i can understand why you would find
    it too fringe and unbelievable.this subject seems illogical,irrational and
    i believe to most human minds subconsciously fearful.the fear is what
    makes the general population laugh.the reason i can say this is because
    i have seen these unconventional traveling machines up close.
    i am 60 years old and own and operate a meat processing plant for the past
    40 years.i have a good grasp on electrical,mechanical and bio engineering.
    my wife and i had 4 of these machines in july 2012 in broad daylight travel
    40 feet over our heads at about 30 mph.the reason most ufo pictures are fuzzy is because these machines from what i could see are completely
    surrounded by an ion plasma field which if you study this you will find
    this is what seems to allow them to over come our laws of physics.
    from the side all you can see is the brilliant orange ion plasma,but from directly underneath you can see the structure or components of these
    machines.there is no sound,there is no exhaust,there is nothing about them like our planes,jets or copters.these are electric machines that can travel
    i believe threw any matrix.these machines are not flying,they travel about at will with an unbelievable technology.absolutely beautiful and magnificent.
    i don't know if this is totally our government et also,i didn't see any little green men.before i saw this i would have been skeptical also but now i know
    this is a very profound subject.my message to the debunkers is if you honestly don't believe ,so be it ,if you know the truth and are lying ,shame
    on you.i will say to all people if you get to look at these machines like my wife and i did,in day light ,40 feet away ,it will make you sit down on the spot
    and say oh my god.i will close by saying we as a people better try to make
    friends with this life form,sadly though we can't even be friends with our own
    people. .

    1. I agree. Been there also on one of Greer's trips. And it as stunning. I have two Master's, so I ain't no fool. And yes I was skeptic at first hand, but no doubt anymore.
      And to Mr. Sheaffer, well, it's easy to debunk everything without proof. I'm glad I know many scientists who witnessed with me using our telescopes pointed at the moon, many activity on the lunar surface on almost daily basis ... from structures up to triangular and round shaped flying obstacles. So please, stop being blind, because different life is all around us.

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  44. "The only people who will be impressed will be those who breathlessly await each new episode of Ancient Aliens on the History Channel."
    This quote, excerpted from the article, sums it up perfectly. What else can I say to add to it?

  45. People WANT to believe...be it aliens or big foot etc. Let them embrace their fantasies as it is a harmless way to get one's mind off the vagaries of survival in this predatory society we live in...Greer makes a buck here and there from the consummate ignorance of a few "out there"..so what?

  46. S Greer is a poo pusher. a turd burglar, a fag and a cock sucker. Bill Ryan of project camelot exposed this about 2010

  47. Greer is simply creating the same confusion that he claims that governments are guilty of, this is just a money making load of BS.


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